Eyes Open

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Posts by Eyes Open

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  26

  So just what or who DO you have faith in now?

  by oompa in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i never used to wonder about death, or what comes after, because i had all the answers!

  but now i really wonder, but not with fear....it feels odd, and i am curious.

  this planet and universe are so incredible and complex that to me it defies logic that someone must have had a creative hand it.

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  Eyes Open

  Life (this type), for as long as it lasts.
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  28

  Are we suffering from a victim mindset?

  by DT in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i don't want to be disrespectful or cause needless disputes, but there are some thoughts that have been bugging me.

  i have to wonder why former members aren't doing more to combat the power of the watchtower society.

  of course, i realise that some have made great contributions and others have to first make their own healing process a priority.

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  Eyes Open

  Actually, I was thinking the other day that it's a damn good job that humans do die once they've had a chance to procreate and produce a fresh brain capable of casting aside fallacies. Just imagine the beliefs many would have today if we didn't.
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  12

  Divine plan of the ages

  by confused and lost in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  whilst reading the chapter entitled "our lords return" in russells book "divine plan of the ages" i came across these interesting quotes :

  to this last view the majority of christians of all denominations assent (notwithstanding the creeds of some to the contrary), from a feeling that any other view would be irreconcilable with justice on god's part.

  but do the scriptures support this last view?

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  Eyes Open

  OBVES:
  I strongly believe we are in the times...

  You should apply to the WTS Writing Committee, OBVES. I hear the pay is good.
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  8

  When is it going to crash?

  by Alex Delta in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i see allot of people here that is in the know i mean really in the know and am very great full for being in these discussion with you all.

  since this is such a large subject to us all and all have different strong points in it, im sure we can come up with some form of hypothesis when this organization is going to implode on its self or when its about to but before it does it bails last minute by changing some doctrine around so it doesnt completely fall but keep enough for them to survive again for it to rebuild, as theyve done so many times in the past.

  history for some reason tends to always repeat it self, i truly believe its about that time.

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  Eyes Open

  Haven't they eased the pressure of time from themselves now anyway? I imagine they've learnt from history and will try to avoid anything very major as long as possible.
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  16

  27 days sober...In new territory

  by digderidoo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i would just like to give an update on my sobriety, as i have had one or two pms regarding it.. this time last year i went almost 4 weeks without a drink but found it incredibly hard each day, so eventually went out one night to see a live band in a pub and started to drink again.

  this time feels different, in that i have the support of the aa and people pn this board to help me out.

  i am not saying it has been easy but i have felt better for it.

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  Eyes Open

  It's the first I've read of it myself, Paul. Well done and all the best with the new territory!
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  28

  Are we suffering from a victim mindset?

  by DT in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i don't want to be disrespectful or cause needless disputes, but there are some thoughts that have been bugging me.

  i have to wonder why former members aren't doing more to combat the power of the watchtower society.

  of course, i realise that some have made great contributions and others have to first make their own healing process a priority.

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  Eyes Open

  Interesting thread.

  I've had thoughts of designing a succint leaflet which could be dropped through letterboxes outlining why organisations like Jehovah's Witnesses don't have truth, warning potential victims, but then reality sets in and I remember I don't have loads of money to get the thing printed and distributed.

  Due to the nature of religious belief, it's impossible in my view to actually bring an organisation down. The WTS vanishing would be something I would dearly love to see, but until humanity has learnt enough to protect itself from religion and cults in general it won't happen.
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  93

  Dating a JW and how to get her off the cult or becoming a member myself

  by svennibenni in

  1. social
  2. relationships

  i'm sorry if i'm totally wrong here but i have a serious problem.. i met a woman in the company i work in via intranet.

  it is a very big company with offices all over the world.

  she moved to the united kingdom just a few month before we met.

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  Eyes Open

  I've started reading Releasing the Bonds: Empowering People to Think for Themselves by Steven Hasson. Perhaps you should grab a copy before getting stuck in, Sven.

  I told her I would quit my job over here to get a job in her country, sell all my things over here and move...I already had some talks and invitations and got a job offered in her branch. My new job will be much less paid and I have worse conditions. And the manager over there just sent me the papers to sign.

  If I were you, I'd consider holding on that until things have panned out a lot more for your sake.

  I will also give up a house I built 10 years ago and loose a lot of money there too

  You sound very committed! I guess you are a fair bit older than the young lady?
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  93

  Dating a JW and how to get her off the cult or becoming a member myself

  by svennibenni in

  1. social
  2. relationships

  i'm sorry if i'm totally wrong here but i have a serious problem.. i met a woman in the company i work in via intranet.

  it is a very big company with offices all over the world.

  she moved to the united kingdom just a few month before we met.

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  Eyes Open

  When you say you have bible lessons, Sven, do you mean you have a bible study with one of Jehovah's Witnesses? Do you mean to say that you discussed Revelation and Job with the young lady?

  If Revelation is a topic that would be natural for you to bring up, I would hope to be able to help with some questions and areas of discussion. In many ways, that book is ideal as it is what gives JWs so much material with which to mislead.
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  93

  Dating a JW and how to get her off the cult or becoming a member myself

  by svennibenni in

  1. social
  2. relationships

  i'm sorry if i'm totally wrong here but i have a serious problem.. i met a woman in the company i work in via intranet.

  it is a very big company with offices all over the world.

  she moved to the united kingdom just a few month before we met.

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  Eyes Open

  As far as I understand, the two of them have decided to remain unmarried until Sven becomes a JW/the girl ceases to be controlled by the cult (a prerequisite to enabling both parties to come out of this with their lives in tact in my opinion). I also understand from what Sven has previously posted in this thread that he wishes to proceed with allowing the girl to free herself, and as they will not be meeting in private anymore I trust that no sexual behaviour will take place while this is an issue in order to protect the girl from herself and her religious leaders.

  sweetface2233
  Svenni, she is sending you mixed signals and treating you very unfairly. I know it hurts, believe me. I have been dealing w/ mixed signals from guys since I was 15 years old. No good can come from this; I can guarantee it. She needs to shit or get off the toilet. She either wants you or she doesn't. She may be young, and that could be the problem, but you both need to be adults here. Stop wasting your time w/ someone who obviously has no clue what she wants. She doesn't even know if she wants to be a JW (going in service, then having some sort of sex w/ you afterward). Cut your losses and move on. There is going to be another girl right around the corner. That, I can also guarantee.

  From an outside perspective, this line of reasoning is certainly sensible. However, Sven has stated that he believes she is worth waiting for - if he's determined to put himself on the line I think we should help him after warning him. The girl is merely a result of the cult way of life, and cannot be expected to make decisions on what we consider a normal basis. Sven must surely understand this by now.

  svennibenni:
  I know the person who will turn out in the end might not be what I want. But the first step in either case is to get her off that shit. Don't you think so ?

  I personally do think so. Others here are concerned about your emotional closeness to her, and you're going to have to be tough with yourself for some time.

  svennibenni:
  I have a bible lesson tonight and after that I want to start asking her a single question that she cannot answer or has some trouble with. Is that wise or what should I do first. I need facts and I need answers.

  Remember Sven - slowly does it. Don't get her stumped on a topic as soon as you start on it. Ease her into the subject gradually, perhaps allowing her to think that it's going entirely the way the WTS wants it to. I'm sorry to repeat myself, but it's so important.

  What kind of bible lessons do you go to? What have you studied with her already, and what was the last thing you discussed? Does she use a particular book or brochure with you?
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  261

  "The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character...

  by digderidoo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ...in all fiction:jealous and proud of it; petty, unjust, unforgiving, control freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty, ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevent bully.

  ", says richard dawkins in the god delusion p51.

  he goes on to say, "those of us schooled from infancy in his ways can become desensitized to their horror".. would you agree?.

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  Eyes Open

  Let me state my position clearly:

  1. I believe in the God of the OT and that the Bible is His inspired record.

  2. I believe the God of the OT is the same as the God of the NT, Jesus of Nazareth, the Messiah.

  3. I believe God is righteous in all His ways even if we don't understand those ways.

  4. I can accept God-sanctioned genocide because of statement #3.

  5. I can accept God-sanctioned slavery because of statement #3.

  6. I can accept all the laws given to the nation of Israel because of statement #3.

  7. I can't judge God as being unjust because my understanding is finite whereas His is infinite.

  8. I have faith that our questions will be answered and our doubts put to rest when He comes again.

  Thanks for clarifying that, snowbird. I took the same position previously, apart from number 2 and possibly number 8.

  As you hold the belief described in number 1, would you be able to answer my previous question?

  Those of you who believe the entire old testament is inspired by God and an accurate record of what happened to his people which is to be taken literally: how do you decide which of the two flood stories you believe?

  The flood is an example of mass extermination by Yahweh and some of the history discussed in this thread is presented as being a result of what comes right after the two intertwined accounts of the flood, so it seems appropriate to get your input on this.